Ezekiel Elliott 2017 Season Outlook

[hangin n wangin]

Some of this s--- sounds like Chinese to me. I'll let the big boys talk.

[timexsocialclub]

9 minutes ago, SadFaceHappy said:

Thank you for your blessings. Back at you.

 

This is bigger than ff or Zeke. This is about a massive political machine that is strangling the life out of America's pastime and gets all sorts of kickbacks. Look up Goodell's (grand?)father.

The NFL is a monopoly and enjoys tax-exempt status as a non-profit. They get multi-billion dollar stadiums (palaces) built with public funds (tax money) then leave whenever they feel like it, usually when tax payers stand up to their extortion. Oakland, St. Louis, San Diego, etc. They charge obscene amounts for tickets even when the stadiums are half full. Yadda, yadda, yadda.

Sure: players choose to play and fans choose to follow. But the NFL takes an active role in gambling to the point of having their own ff platform. They make billions from people with money at stake but ignore fair dealing when it suits them.

What sets me off about the Zeke thing is the arbitrary nature of their process, which boils down to "we want to suspend Zeke, have a specious reason to do so, will go through the motions of 'investigating' but will suspend him regardless. If the courts say we've done so improperly, we'll just find another court. Product be damned, we must let all the little people (including players) know that we are omnipotent."

And this is exactly on keeping with larger trends in our society, especially press and politics (which the NFL is part and parcel of). I'm not going to continue with a political rant since sports used to be an avenue of escape from such things.

But how much arbitrary application of law are we prepared to submit to? How much emotional distress has the constant uncertainty surrounding Zeke's situation caused?

What F-ing motivation does Goodell have? Is he untouchable? Who else is? Certainly not you and I

I like this post.

[DJSatane]

So who is better bet for value Morris or McFadden if Zeke does get suspended past week 5?

[timexsocialclub]

3 minutes ago, jonasdash said:

I suspect it's a case where 5th Circuit would like to set precedent for a TRO/Injunction case to be submitted prior to a ruling, but then ripening due to ruling being made before the presiding judge issues his ruling on the case - thus preventing future similar emergency stays of this nature being submitted to them due to setting precedent here that the lower court does have jurisdiction. 

Instant migraine.

[gufomel]

7 minutes ago, jonasdash said:

I suspect it's a case where 5th Circuit would like to set precedent for a TRO/Injunction case to be submitted prior to a ruling, but then ripening due to ruling being made before the presiding judge issues his ruling on the case - thus preventing future similar emergency stays of this nature being submitted to them due to setting precedent here that the lower court does have jurisdiction. 

I have no idea what you just said.  Can you explain?

[CooL]

I think the panic is not seeing the Zeke from last year, seeing him get stuffed by Denver,  seeing the guy who had his hands on his hips after an INT and getting called out for lack of effort.  If Zeke was playing like Todd Gurley right now, I'm sure we wouldn't be complaining at all.

[CrastersCreep]

15 minutes ago, Fiveohnine said:

Jordy was a 1st rounder who practiced fully all week and Martin will be back week 5 with no BYE left. Plus Zeke has been sucking anyway? I mean obviously this is the Zeke thread so you guys think his value is really high even with a 6 game ban looming over his head. But then there's the rest of the world.

He's been sucking anyway? Or you're just basing that on one game?

[Gohawks]

14 minutes ago, SadFaceHappy said:

Thank you for your blessings. Back at you.

 

This is bigger than ff or Zeke. This is about a massive political machine that is strangling the life out of America's pastime and gets all sorts of kickbacks. Look up Goodell's (grand?)father.

The NFL is a monopoly and enjoys tax-exempt status as a non-profit. They get multi-billion dollar stadiums (palaces) built with public funds (tax money) then leave whenever they feel like it, usually when tax payers stand up to their extortion. Oakland, St. Louis, San Diego, etc. They charge obscene amounts for tickets even when the stadiums are half full. Yadda, yadda, yadda.

Sure: players choose to play and fans choose to follow. But the NFL takes an active role in gambling to the point of having their own ff platform. They make billions from people with money at stake but ignore fair dealing when it suits them.

What sets me off about the Zeke thing is the arbitrary nature of their process, which boils down to "we want to suspend Zeke, have a specious reason to do so, will go through the motions of 'investigating' but will suspend him regardless. If the courts say we've done so improperly, we'll just find another court. Product be damned, we must let all the little people (including players) know that we are omnipotent."

And this is exactly on keeping with larger trends in our society, especially press and politics (which the NFL is part and parcel of). I'm not going to continue with a political rant since sports used to be an avenue of escape from such things.

But how much arbitrary application of law are we prepared to submit to? How much emotional distress has the constant uncertainty surrounding Zeke's situation caused?

What F-ing motivation does Goodell have? Is he untouchable? Who else is? Certainly not you and I

The NFL is a private company. They can do what they choose as long as it is not outside the law. When players decide to give all the rights to the commissioner it's on them.

 

Do I like Goodell? Good lord no. He is Kim Jong Un. A turd sandwich. However, nothing he has done is illegal. From what i've seen, Elliot is a pretty big d-bag himself and I think a suspension would actually serve him well long-term in terms of straightening him out. The players chose to give all the rights to Goodell and now they are suffering. Saying they should be sued is a joke.

 

Also, no it is not bigger than FF or Zeke. At best, it is as big as football. Nothing past that. 

[Thinkingcap]

5 minutes ago, gufomel said:

I have no idea what you just said.  Can you explain?

He doesn't know what he's talking about. 

[FreakFries]

Anyone know how to set up a Go-Fund-Me account? Might be nice to send the appellate judges some early, you know, Christmas presents. A little appreciation for the tough decision ahead. 

[SadFaceHappy]

28 minutes ago, Gohawks said:

The NFL is a private company. They can do what they choose as long as it is not outside the law. When players decide to give all the rights to the commissioner it's on them.

 

Do I like Goodell? Good lord no. He is Kim Jong Un. A turd sandwich. However, nothing he has done is illegal. From what i've seen, Elliot is a pretty big d-bag himself and I think a suspension would actually serve him well long-term in terms of straightening him out. The players chose to give all the rights to Goodell and now they are suffering. Saying they should be sued is a joke.

 

Also, no it is not bigger than FF or Zeke. At best, it is as big as football. Nothing past that. 

I can't argue with anything you said except the last paragraph. The players signed an atrocious deal in some respects.

Does the Zeke fiasco have any influence beyond football?  Maybe.  Is it related and reflective of larger problems?  Certainly.

The issue at hand is arbitrary authority and the extent to which we, as a people, tolerate it. I'd add the level of incompetence/corruption we accept possessed by those in leadership positions whom we lament, yet simultaneously entrust with greater powers.

I am frustrated that this aspect of Zeke's Saga (trademark?) is not simply overlooked, but meekly accepted.

I believe the success of Goodell, and those who exhibit similar behavioral patterns and inhabit comparable stations, come at the expense of the rest of us.

BTW, this is 3 years in a row (will be 4 if Zeke's injunction holds up) that the biggest NFL story is about the league enforcing it's dominance arbitrarily and opaquely.

I understand, this isn't the place to discuss such existential concerns (and we peons must know our place and what we are allowed to discuss there), so I'll end my diatribe while posing a final question:

What good has Goodell done, and what will be his long term impact on the sport we love?

 

BTW: I, personally, will not be cuffing Zeke because I don't see value in either Morris or McFadden. The Oline is not quite as dominant as it was 2-3 years ago and I don't see much potential for either of those guys, at this point in their careers, to take advantage and perform consistently at an rb2 level. I believe replacement production is best sought elsewhere. 

Edited September 22, 2017 by SadFaceHappy

[Lord_Varys]

1 hour ago, Lord_Varys said:

 

Source? 

 

1 hour ago, sott3 said:

Never forget: Read RotoWorld for the news, not the analysis. Their analysis is usually written without any forward thinking and the logic doesn't follow from week to week. A guy will have a bad game and RW says he's droppable. The next week he gets a TD and they say he's an every week starter. 

 

Bump. 

 

This is the same editorial staff who reported Hyde might get cut. It's a lazy rumor mill that tries to maximize clicks. Sometimes they are insightful, sometimes not. Just read the news and do your own thinking. 

[jonasdash]

27 minutes ago, gufomel said:

I have no idea what you just said.  Can you explain?

I can try.  Let's define a few things first.  

1) an Injunction is where you stop a previous ruling from taking place until the court can fully hear the case and decide if the ruling was made fairly.  

2)  a case being Ripe means that a case is ready to be heard by the Supreme Court because all the other avenues for determining the fairness of the case have been exhausted.

My thought is that the higher court, the 5th Circuit, would like to make a ruling that would become standard basis for future court matters so that they will not be expected to handle cases that the lower court is within their capability to handle and have already made rulings about.  The basis they want to set up would be that in the future, requests for an injunction which are made to lower courts are still valid to be ruled on by the lower court if the lower court finds the case has become Ripe in the time between when it was submitted and when it was ruled upon.  

In essence, the 5th Circuit wants to get this sort of thing 'on the books' so that in the future, they will have grounds to say 'we've already looked at similar cases to yours and we've already said XXXXX, so motion is granted/denied (stop bothering us, we're busy with legit cases) 

The question is if XXXXX is going to be YES - the NFL is right , or NO - the NFL is wrong.  I believe they will say NO - the NFL is wrong.   

[jonasdash]

42 minutes ago, Thinkingcap said:

He doesn't know what he's talking about. 

 

I assure you I do.

[burninglegs]

7 minutes ago, jonasdash said:

In essence, the 5th Circuit wants to get this sort of thing 'on the books' so that in the future, they will have grounds to say 'we've already looked at similar cases to yours and we've already said XXXXX, so motion is granted/denied (stop bothering us, we're busy with legit cases) 

 

 

The Federal courts (2nd Circuit) has already ruled the NFL has that authority under the CBA and that Goodell has broad discretion under that CBA to do as he pleases. If the Federal courts have any consistency, they will refer back to the 2nd Circuit and their judgment on this issue. 

[jonasdash]

Just now, burninglegs said:

 

 

The Federal courts (2nd Circuit) has already ruled the NFL has that authority under the CBA and that Goodell has broad discretion under that CBA to do as he pleases. If the Federal courts have any consistency, they will refer back to the 2nd Circuit and their judgment on this issue. 

 

That is wholly beside the point.  The CBA requires specifics of due process to be met during an investigation and appeals process to enable him to make a ruling, if the NFL violate these terms they are in breach and thus subject to litigation. 

[ninjacookies]

3 hours ago, Excellent117 said:

 

Judge Mazzant's denial of the motion for an emergency stay was essentially a purely procedural matter. It was necessary to get the motion appealed to the Circuit Court level. Your assertion has no basis in fact at the moment, as it's fairly unusual for a Circuit Court to even grant a hearing on an appeal of a denied motion for an emergency stay. This is not a good development for Zeke or his owners. 

 

The 5th Circuit is the most conservative in the country and not union-friendly in the slightest. I could easily see them pointing to the 2nd Circuit case law and determining that Zeke and the NFLPA are highly unlikely to succeed on the merits, thereby staying the injunction and starting Zeke's suspension immediately. . 

This is all you need to know.

[jonasdash]

7 minutes ago, ninjacookies said:

This is all you need to know.

 

That is certainly not all you need to know. 

 

 

you may asl then, is this issue about jurisdiction?




I think that makes it clear this is very much about jurisdiction

 

Edited September 23, 2017 by jonasdash

[ozark]

6 minutes ago, jonasdash said:

 

That is certainly not all you need to know. 

 

 

you may asl then, is this issue about jurisdiction?




I think that makes it clear this is very much about jurisdiction

 

This makes me feel a bit better, don't they have every right to file? 

[ozark]

Without getting to AC are owners feeling comfortable with this process or looking to sell now? 

[Rainyy]

I have a bad feeling about this.

 

I remember being confused when the NFLPA filed BEFORE the NFL's "neutral" arbiter has heard the appeal. All my posts regarding potential timeline operated under the assumption Zeke would file after he lost the internal appeal. 

 

The issue here is about STANDING, which is a constitutional requirement in every case. Basically, a person can only sue when he has suffered an actual or imminent harm/injury. You obviously can't sue your neighbor for trespass under the suspicion that he might trespass on your property next week. 

 

The issue here is that the NFL was still deciding the matter when Zeke filed. There was no actual injury as the suspension was not yet upheld and could technically be overturned. 

 

If the 5th circuit finds the claim was RIPE - that is, it was filed too early before the imminent/actual injury - then the entire case will be dismissed and the parties will race to re-file. 

 

Even if we get over the standing issue, the 5th circuit is ruling on the injunction long before the NFL season is over. I much rather would have had Zeke missing the first 6 weeks - during his toughest slate of games - than missing the middle or end of the season.

Edited September 23, 2017 by Rainyy

[jonasdash]

2 minutes ago, ozark said:

This makes me feel a bit better, don't they have every right to file? 

I'm no federal judge, but Judge Mazzant certainly felt they did and several law scholars have agreed.  I see no reason to believe the NFLPA did not have a right to file or did so in an inappropriate manner.  That is what the 5th Circuit is likely going to be reviewing.   Worst case, they make NFLPA re-file, which would happen the same day as the ruling and there is not sufficient proof of irreparable harm to allow Zeke to continue to play while he is in process of appealing. 

[joey0480]

I cant follow all the legal stuff....way i see it, grab morris or dmc if available

[tpat30]

And LOL at people worrying and complaining about Zeke's game against Denver where they get blown out 42-17 and Elliott gets 9 carries. EE looked good against the Giants, probably should've had a TD but Dallas moronically passed it 3 straight times on the GL. That's the difference between 13 and 19 points against a solid Giants defense.

[Rainyy]

Just now, tpat30 said:

And LOL at people worrying and complaining about Zeke's game against Denver where they get blown out 42-17 and Elliott gets 9 carries. EE looked good against the Giants, probably should've had a TD but Dallas moronically passed it 3 straight times on the GL. That's the difference between 13 and 19 points against a solid Giants defense.

 

I honestly wasn't that impressed at his performance versus the Giants. I know they're a stingy run defense and 4.3 YPC is solid, but the O-line played well and he mostly just "took what he was given."

 

First time owning Zeke and I didn't get to watch a lot of him last year. Honestly he doesn't seem like a special or electric runner. Just a good mixture of speed/power and a great line. What am I missing. 

 

Still think he is easily a Top 5 option when healthy because of the volume, line, and sufficient talent to make use of it. But I was a little uninspired.